Managing Bowhunters?

[Allure]

I am currently located in the Thabazimbi region and cater for bow hunters as I have a 250ha farm that I am in the process of now purchasing and to keep my animals tame this is my only option that is suitable.

I have had some experiences that have not been too pleasurable of late and am trying to find solutions to minimize these problems. I hasten to add that many of the bowhunters are good ethical chaps who deserve credit for good representation of the bow hunt fraternity.

The problems I have are as follows;

Firstly I have no shortage of animals - as I stock the farm on a regular basis - at least 3 times per year.
I make use of Pit blinds of which I have 2 well located blinds at permanent water.

Bowhunting is supposed to supplement my income to pay wages etc so I need guys to come in and actually shoot animals but what I have experienced of late is hunters come in and they shoot francolin, guniea fowl, monkeys, baboons and they let arrows fly at animals that disappear only to be found a week later due to the smell of rotting flesh (this adds up to a pure loss in my book). My question is how to curb this? Unlike rifle hunting where you can send a tracker/spotter with bow hunters want to sit on their own so as an owner I have no control of what arrows are pulled?


I have spoken to other game farmers that operate bowhunting operations in the area and a few suggestions have come forth.

1.Count all arrows into the blind - (this is all good and well but there is a waterpoint to wash any blood or trace off.)

2.Lock the bowhunter in the blind - this would be quite entertaining if there were a nice big fat black mamba that would suddenly like to take up residence in the same blind.

3. Have a specified list of animals that may be harvested and if there is stray from the approved list heavy penalties (20k a baboon sounds like a nice price for me) - I have no issue with taking problem animals like baboons etc - it is just the issue of wounding them and failing to disclose that arrows were let loose...

4.Setting up a system of cameras to monitor the area?

Finding a solution to such a thing is not always easy but using a sounding board such as Jaracal may just be the answer to finding level ground - so if you have comments or suggestions I would really like to hear them.

[FCLoretz]

I would suggest that you count arrows into the blind and arrows out of the blind when the hunters enter and leave.

I would also look into a system with 2x wireless IP cameras(1x inside blind, 1x Outside towards shooting area) to record video and save on a HD for 7 days.

but ultimately you should rely on the honesty of your customers. Which is proving more and more difficult these days

[anthony1]

Hi

I'm a bow hunter and I agree that there are few bow hunters that make it hard for Farm owners to trust the rest of the group I have a few thoughts that might help

1 don't lock the door just get the ph/guide/tracker to put a small rock against the door that can be easily pushed away but try to put it back once you are in the hide it's going to be difficult

2 put a minimum price on shooting a bobo or any of the problem animals you want off say if there has been a total of R2000.00 worth of others animals shot then the problem animals are free or they coast R500/bobo ect.

3 counting and limiting the number of arrows is also fair

4 On the wounding animals and staying quiet put a sentence in you terms/condition that states that if a animal is found within a week and the decay points to the weekend before, that the hunting party is responsible for the payment of that animal its hard to control but honesty is still the best remedy.

these are a few of the rules on some of the hunting farms I've been on they seem to work

[SV MAD (Henk)]

Agree

Sorry to hear about your experiences, the way you say your farm is, makes me want to come and hunt there as an ethical, honest bowhunter, as I think it is a win win situation.

Wireless IR cameras as suggested,
Rock against the door

[FHM]

Jeez yeah, this is a difficult one Allure.
Off-hand it would seem that your best measure of controlling random shooting will be arrow count hide-in and before hide-out. I suppose an addition to your standard hunting rules of a hunter to remain in the hide after a shot taken - should be considdered. How practical it will be in executing remains debatable though. A camera covering the hide itself is perhaps your only means of actually controlling the situation. Interesting discussion this one.

[Philip_R]

Ek sou voorstel dat jy nie die deur sluit nie, juis oor die potensiele mamba of dalk word 'n bok gespine en dan moet die jagter hom dalk gaan verlos.

Jy kan wel 'n klein "cable-tie" of iets wat jy aan die deur kan vasmaak wat sal breek as die persoon uit die skuiling gaan aan die deur sit van buite af. Dan kan jy die pyle tel en dalk sê dat die jagter nie sy boogtas/sak in die skuiling mag inneem nie. So doende kan jy maklik sien hoeveel pyle hy in die skuiling invat en as die seël op die deur gebreek is moet die man 'n goeie verduideliking hê. Dit is algemene reels dat mens nie die skuiling mag verlaat nie, anders begin die diere die skuiling met mense assosieer.

Sit ook op jou pryslys 'n prys op bobbejane as jy nie wil hê die manne moet hulle skiet nie. Of maak 'n duidelike lys van diere wat nie geskiet mag word nie, anders moet hy die vervang kostes betaal.

Daar is op ander forums/en seker hier ook manne wat spesialiseer in boogjag en dit al baie jare doen wat jou dalk beter raad kan gee oor presies wat hulle oor die jare geleer het werk. Dit gesê daar sal altyd die ape wees wat kanse vat.

[henried]

Baretta will tel you about the cost of a nice camera system at blind....

Some farms insists that you sit with a guide. Request from bow hunters, please provide him with food for the day, ask him to be clean, good bath will help.

Limit or count the arrows. Look at fetches, can even take photo.

The safety issue for locking them in a blind as well as the risk is not worth it. Rules should stipulate that they are not allowed to get out unless you are there.

You need to have rules, and this should be given to them upfront. You can even ask them to sign it.

Do you have trail cameras at your blinds?
Do the game come in regularly?
Was it one group or all groups this year?

[Allure]

I would suggest that you count arrows into the blind and arrows out of the blind when the hunters enter and leave.

I would also look into a system with 2x wireless IP cameras(1x inside blind, 1x Outside towards shooting area) to record video and save on a HD for 7 days.

but ultimately you should rely on the honesty of your customers. Which is proving more and more difficult these days

Tried this - I am embarrassed/horrified for the hunter on his part - makes matters worse he was all alone in there.....

Thanks for the response thus far..

[FCLoretz]

I would suggest that you count arrows into the blind and arrows out of the blind when the hunters enter and leave.

I would also look into a system with 2x wireless IP cameras(1x inside blind, 1x Outside towards shooting area) to record video and save on a HD for 7 days.

but ultimately you should rely on the honesty of your customers. Which is proving more and more difficult these days

Tried this - I am embarrassed/horrified for the hunter on his part - makes matters worse he was all alone in there.....

Thanks for the response thus far..

Now I am intrigued, do tell....

[DWB]

Put a pressure switch infront of the shooting hole where the shooter must stand, which will then activate the camera. Or a beam or something like that

[Allure]

This is not all groups it is rather the minimum and this is why I hasten to add it is the minority but as with anything in life "we all get tarnished with the same brush because of a single persons behavior".
I like bowhunters because they come to shoot and generally speaking their behavior is better than that of rifle hunters (they drink less - mainly because I think they don't want to let every animal around the blind know that they are there and also because they have to be really sharp when it comes to pulling the arrow etc. A bow hunter I have also experienced comes to take animals and not just walk around the farm on a cheap weekend holiday.
I have no issue with the bobbo's or vervets/ jackals etc it is just that if these are free or too cheap then they are the ones that get targeted and nothing else - I like the idea of charging a premium for these animals if nothing else is shot.
I have camera's up at the blinds but mostly when I donot have hunters in - we have experienced missing SD cards etc.
Problem is with finding an animal even a few days later - trying to charge guys that are dishonest in the first place you have 2 chances of getting any loot out of them after the fact.
Game comes in on a regular basis as the water supply on the farm is limited and due to the fact of no rifle hunting -other than at night the animals are quite relaxed.
I am actually at the point of putting up a CCTV system around my blinds similar to what I use in my breeding camps.

[Allure]

Put a pressure switch infront of the shooting hole where the shooter must stand, which will then activate the camera. Or a beam or something like that

Like a "Landmine"

[Allure]

I hate being a policeman - I note the individuals and when they call me again I am unable to accommodate them...

[Eugene]

Allure, jammer ek ek antwoord jou in Afrikaans, maar dit gaan baie vinniger gaan en meer verstaanbaar wees, as wat ek dit in Engels doen!

'n Plaas waar ons gereeld gaan jag, vat jy net jou boog en pyle in 'n bow qwiver saam. Die boer weet presies hoeveel pyle elke ou het en ook watter tipe pyle en fletches elke jagter het. Die reels is duidelikd at jy GLAD nie uit die hide mag klim nie en die boer kyk vir voetspore rondom die hide as hy jou kom haal. Duidelik vee merke tel ook onder voetspore. Die boer het 'n duidelik stel reels in elke hide, tesame met die pryslys. Daarop word tarentale, hase en blouape te koop aangebied teen R1000 stuk. 'n Duiker en steenbok is R5000 stuk! Die boer het 'n fantastiese hond wat by elke hide afspring en 'n vinnig draai maak, as die hond terugkom, is daar niks gekwes nie, as die hond egter begin blaf, word daar bloedspoor gevat en is jy verantwoordelik.

[Philip_R]

Allure, Try putting a small breakable lock (Small cable tie or similar) on the doors of the blinds first before going over the cost of installing a CCTV system. The honest guys will not have a problem as they will not break the rules. Make sure you state on your pricelist or farm rules clearly before reservations are made that the hide door will be closed with a cable tie to monitor if a hunter has left the hide due to previous bad experiences.

I for one will not have any issues with this as a hunter.

Guys that know they are going to leave the hide without reason will refrain from making a reservation. In the end you can use it mainly as a filtering tool and later no policing might be required.

[SV MAD (Henk)]

I have no issue with a cable tie on a door. If there is a mamba, a cable tie will not hold me inside, and I am sure that the farmer will then believe me when I tell him.

I just think it is the right thing to do when you have shot an animal, call in the shot, wait in the hide until the farmer arrives. Only then you get out. I normally do not even collect my arrow, the farmer or the help will pick it up and then we study it together. All of this builds trust, and make that I have a place for next years hunt.

[Philip_R]

Henk I think the new pair of pant required will help convince him.... And I think that if a mamba enters the hide all hunters will call it in while the mamba is still there, and the snake will leave a "sleepsel"/spoor as proof.

I also think that honest hunters will build a trusted relationship with Allure within a short period of time which will give him a client base of returning hunters.

[SV MAD (Henk)]

I also think that honest hunters will build a trusted relationship with Allure within a short period of time which will give him a client base of returning hunters.

Totally agree

[egenis]

Alllure!

I also think the monitoring of the hides is a good idea. Use trail cam that are activated by movement. Expensive option though to put up cams at all your hides.

Counting arrows will also work - note the type of arrow, color of fletches and type of broadhead etc.

Locking the guys in the hides - I do not like this option and I would not like to be locked up myself.

But at the end of the day - it's all about trust. You will have the few bad apples that can circumvent all your measures put in place - but that should be the minumum.


Edit - place a charge on babboons, guinea fowls and the like to act as a deterence - if it's free they will try to shoot it. If you feel like it, these charges can then be waivered?

[molopohunter]

Raking around the blind and counting arrows and taking a quick phone pic of the fletches help.
Then no need to lock the hunter up, and if a arrow is missing he has to produce it, if blood found but no animal, have a penalty system in place.
2 way radios also work well to fetch the guy, unless your cell signal is good.

Kind regards,
Peet

[DJ V]

The most bow hunters I have dealt with are honest guys and I think to generalise this across all is a bit unfair. The honest guys will perhaps feel a bit hard done by if draconian rules are put in place.

This topic - just a bit broader on poundage etc etc- was discussed on Anchor Point a few weeks ago. The link is below if you can access it.
http://www.anchorpoint.co.za/showthread ... s-wat-pla.

Just by quickly scanning the post again was that all bow hunters there agreed that rules should be in place - however not all were happy about the cable tie thing.

Allure - this however does not answer your question. You are the boss there and I think to spend R1000's in camera's etc etc is going a bit overboard - and perhaps not economically viable. I think the main thing is that when on booking your hunt the farm owner releases all the rules pertaining to his farm (his farm - his rules). If you do not like them, go and hunt elsewhere where the rules suit you (or where there are none - yes you hear that as well - farm owners allowing rifle hunting from blinds )

I have hunted on farms where the guinea fowl are off limits - sorry for you, punt en klaar. Why however would a bowhunter shoot the guinea fowl if he is booked to shoot for eg a BWB? Your farm is quite small (although I feel some pangs of jealousy flaring up in me) and that would bust his hunt on the BWB.

The advice above is sound and I think from this you can get a few rules in place to protect your investment and the animals on your farm. When the guy plans to come hunt - release all this rules and the guys that have no issues will come.

The cowboys will go elsewhere.

Oh yes - pm me your pricelist please?

[SV MAD (Henk)]

Me too, pricelist please

[Philip_R]

Allure, jy kan maar jou pryslys (en plaasreels) vir my ook stuur asb.

[FCLoretz]

Jy kan vir my ook stuur asb Allure

fcloretz at hotmail dot com

[egenis]

Kan ek hom ook kry asb?