Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

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jdpretorius
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by jdpretorius »

OosKaapJagter wrote:Vrystaat jag gaan dalk een van die dae nie meer kan jag met so benadering nie.

Kom ons evalueer die "fake news". Die formaat is presies in die korrekte formaat soos dit in staatskoerante gepubliseer word. Die wysigingswetsontwerp is maar net 148 bladsye lank.

Wie sou dus soveel tyd op hande hê om 148 bladsye se weldeurdagte snert saam te stel? Die taalgebruik en verwysing na bestaande artikels strook met die wat gevind word in amptelike wetswysigings.

Iemand het duidelik die dokument gekopieer en vrygestel teen die wense van diegene wat dit vir eers stil wou hou. Dit is insiggewend dat daar op elke bladsy so groot kennisgewing "Do not print" in skuinsgedruk daarop verskyn.
Waar daar 'n rookie is, is daar mos 'n vuurtjie.
Ek sal my self ook nie wys kan maak dat dit nie iets te doen het met grond oneining nie en dat dit nie deel is van die anc se lang termyn plan of SA heeltemal te assimileer in nog 'n zimbabwe nie
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by LeRoy »

Ek het nog altyd ewe melodramaties, nes Chartlon Heston, gesê 'hulle' sal net my vuurwapens oor my dooie liggaam vat, indien die ding netso deurgaan is ek dalk by daardie punt ++>:
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

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Mail van SA Jag af:

"18 October 2018

Dear colleague

Since yesterday, I have been inundated with calls and e-mail messages on the “Draft Firearms Control Amendment Bill” that suddenly appeared and is distributed in many ways all over the country.

I deliberately did not want to make any statement until I had some certainty on the authenticity of the document and could provide guidance on the process to be followed with at least some indication on the timing required to amend legislation.

1. What is the Status of this “Draft Firearms Control Amendment Bill?”

This document has no legal status whatsoever. It certainly is nothing more than a discussion paper or a “think piece” at best. It is not valid, and it does not have any legal status or position in the law-making process.

2. The Draft Firearms Control Amendment Bill

Those of you who did not yet receive a copy of the “Draft Firearms Control Amendment Bill” will find a copy here should you want to read it.

This document indeed is written in the format of a “Draft Firearms Control Amendment Bill”. It was most likely produced by the legal department of the SAPS in 2017, and intended to be presented to the Minister of Police for consideration as a possible amendment to the Firearms Control Act. Some of the suggested changes provided for in this draft are indeed draconian to say the least.

The document was leaked from the Police, and I believe this was done deliberately to create panic among firearm owners and to draw the attention away from a number of other more important matters that the Police do not know how to deal with. Unfortunately, a number of individuals, associations and the press fell for it, and fuelled the panic.

Releasing this document now is a creative and clever way to create panic to hide other urgent matters, i.e.:

There are still about 750 000 old green licences valid since 2009;
More or less 470 000 white licences that had lapsed and not renewed in time; and
the SAPS legal team applied for approval to appeal the GOSA interim interdict and for months already have not done anything further about it.
3. The statement from the Chairman of the Portfolio Committee on Police

Yesterday afternoon, the Chairman of the Portfolio Committee on Police, Mr Francois Beukman, issued a statement after being inundated with calls and messages about this “Draft Firearms Control Amendment Bill”. He confirmed that this document has no legal status and stated that this “Draft Bill” is not on the agenda of the Portfolio Committee. A copy of the press statement by Mr Beukman is available here.

4. The process to Amend an Act

Amendment of an act must follow a specific process. It is drafted by a legal team and presented to the relevant minister for consideration and approval. If the minister is satisfied, it usually goes to Cabinet for consideration from where it is referred to the relevant parliamentary portfolio committee for consideration and approval.

The portfolio committee reviews the draft and makes the necessary changes, after which is published in a Government Gazette for public consideration and comment. These comments are considered, amendments are made to the draft and debated in the portfolio committee. Once the Portfolio Committee is satisfied, the draft is referred to Parliament for consideration and approval, and finally sent to the President to be signed and promulgated. This process normally takes at least six months.

Consider for instance, that the President promised in his opening speech in Parliament in February 2018, that a national minimum wage was to be implemented in May 2018. It is already the second half of October and the process has yet to be finalised for implementation.

Parliament goes in recess at the end of November and re-opens early February 2019. The programme for the Portfolio Committee on Police for the rest of this year has been finalised. The Chairman confirmed that this “Draft Amendment Bill” was not on the Agenda of the Committee.

We could expect an election in April 2019. From the time Parliament opens again in February 2019, until the date we have the election, no material amendments to legislation will happen. All that will be done, is to finalise matters that have not been completed yet before parliament gets disbanded for the election.

5. What will SA Hunters do?

SA Hunters we will carefully watch out for any changes that would be made with the intent to amend the Firearms Control Act, and we will most certainly respond appropriately. It is commonly known that where the process is seen to be unfair and unreasonable, SA Hunters will fight the case and if necessary take legal action and approach the High Court for relief.

Furthermore, SA Hunters will take constructive action in an attempt to change the Firearms Control Act that would streamline the process and ensure we retain the right to protect ourselves, our families and our assets. We will remain rational, realistic and reasonable. We will not be intimidated or upset by a document that has no legal status whatsoever. The suggested work to be done by SA Hunters’ strategy on this matter, will be presented to Congress on 3 November 2018 for consideration and approval.

6. What should members do?

Please calm down and relax and do not pay attention to others and their actions. Nothing will happen without your knowledge.

Rather take our advice. Use your firearms with care and take care of them. If you have licences that lapsed without being renewed, lock the firearms away safely and wait for the process to unfold.

Advise your friends to join a reliable and credible association that will support their interests and to fight our cause with us.

7. Press Statement

SA Hunters also issued a press statement on this matter. You will find the press statement here.

Yours sincerely

Fred Camphor

SA Hunters CEO"
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

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Vir ouens wat nie Engels verstaan nie

18 Oktober 2018

Beste kollega

Ek word sedert gister oorval met oproepe en e-pos na aanleiding van `n sogenaamde konsepwysigingswetsontwerp op die Wet op die Beheer van Vuurwapens wat skielik landwyd op sosiale media soos `n veldbrand versprei het.

Ek wou eers agter die kap van die byl kom en die egtheid van die dokument verifieer voordat ek daarop reageer.

1. Wat is die status van hierdie konsepwetsontwerp?

Die dokument het geen regstatus nie en op sy beste is dit `n besprekingsdokument. Dus is dit nie geldig nie en ook nie deel van die standaardproses waaraan wetgewing moet voldoen nie.

2. Die Konsepwetsontwerp op die Beheer van Vuurwapens

`n Eksemplaar van die “Konsepwetsontwerp op die Beheer van Vuurwapens” is hier beskikbaar vir enigeen wat dit wil lees.

Die dokument voldoen inderdaad aan die formaat van `n konsepwetsontwerp en spruit waarskynlik uit die regsafdeling van die SAPD in 2017, wat bedoel was vir voorlegging aan die Minister van Polisie vir oorweging. Sommige van die voorgestelde veranderinge is drakonies van aard, om dit minste daarvan te sê.

Dit blyk dat die dokument by die SAPD uitgelek het. Ek vermoed dat dit doelbewus gedoen is om paniek onder vuurwapeneienaars te skep en om die aandag af te lei van ander belangriker sake wat die Polisie nie weet hoe om te hanteer nie. Ongelukkig is daar individue en verenigings wat hiervoor geval het, en die paniek aanvuur.

Die vrystelling van hierdie dokument is `n slu en kreatiewe manier om as `n dekmantel te dien vir groter probleme, soos:

Daar is steeds sowat 750 000 groen lisensies wat sedert 2009 geldig is;
Sowat 470 000 wit lisensies het reeds verval en is nie betyds hernu nie;
DIE SAPD se regspan het aansoek om appèl teen GOSA se tussentydse bevel gedoen, maar vir maande gebeur daar steeds niks.
3. Die verklaring deur die Voorsitter van die Portefeuljekomitee op Polisie

Mnr Francois Beukman, Voorsitter van die Portefeuljekomitee op Polisie het gistermiddag (Woensdag, 17 Oktober 2018) `n verklaring uitgereik om te bevestig dat die dokument geen regstatus het nie en ook nie op die sakelys is vir bespreking deur die portefeuljekomitee nie. `Lees mnr. Beukman se verklaring hier.

4. Die proses om `n wet te wysig

Die wysiging van enige wet moet aan `n spesifieke proses voldoen. `n Regspan stel die dokument saam en lê dit voor aan die betrokke minister vir oorweging en goedkeuring. Indien die minister dit goedkeur, word dit na die kabinet verwys vir oorweging, waarna dit na die parlementere portefeuljekomitee verwys word vir oorweging en goedkeuring.

Die portefeuljekomitee bring enige veranderinge aan die konsepwetsontwerp aan, waarna dit in die Staatskoerant gepubliseer word vir openbare kommentaar. Hierdie kommentaar word oorweeg en verdere veranderinge word aan die konsepwetsontwerp aangebring en weer deur die portefeuljekomitee bespreek. Indien die portefeuljekomitee tevrede is, word dit aan Parlement gestuur vir oorweging en goedkeuring. Eers hierna word dit aan die President gestuur vir ondertekening en promulgering. Hierdie proses kan tot ses maande duur.

Vergelyk dit met President se aankondiging in die parlement in Februarie vanjaar dat `n nuwe minimum loon in Mei in werking sou tree. Ons is reeds aan die einde van Oktober, en niks daarvan is nog gefinaliseer nie.

Die parlement gaan teen einde November in reses en heropen eers vroeg in Februarie 2019. Die Portefeuljekomitee op Polisie se werk vir die jaar is ook reeds gefinaliseer. Die voorsitter het bevestig dat hierdie konsepwetsontwerp beslis nie op die komitee se sakelys verskyn nie.

Ons verwag `n verkiesing in April 2019. Vanaf die opening van die parlement in Februarie tot die verkiesing in April, sal geen veranderinge aan wetgewing gemaak word. Nie. Al wat gaan aandag kry is om sake wat oorgestaan het af te handel voordat die parlement ontbind word voor die verkiesing.

5. Wat gaan SA Jagters nou doen?

SA Jagters hou die situasie fyn dop en sal beslis reageer op enige voorstelle vir wysigings aan die Wet op die Beheer van Vuurwapens. Wees gerus dat SA Jagters hom tot die hof sal wend om beswaar te maak teen enige onbillike en onregverdige voorstelle.

SA Jagters sal ook konstruktiewe insette lewer om die Wet op die Beheer van Vuurwapens te verbeter en om te verseker dat ons ons reg behou om onsself, ons families en ons eiendom te beskerm. Ons sal rasioneel, realisties en redelik bly en nie geïntimideer word deur `n dokument wat geen regstatus het nie. SA Jagters sal sy planne om hierdie situasie te hanteer, op 3 November 2018, aan die kongres voorlê vir oorweging en goedkeuring.

6. Wat staan lede te doen?

Ontspan en bly kalm. Moenie u steur aan ander mense en hulle optrede nie. Niks sal sonder u medewete gebeur nie.

Gebruik u vuurwapen versigtig en oordeelkundig. Indien u vuurwapenlisensie verval het en u nie betyds vir hernuwing aansoek gedoen het nie, sluit die vuurwapen veilig weg in die kluis tot ons later duidelikheid oor die situasie kry.

Raai u vriende aan om by `n betroubare vereniging aan te sluit wat na hulle belange sal omsien.

7. Persverklaring

SA Jagters het `n persverklaring hieroor uitgereik. Lees hier. http://www.sahunters.co.za/index.php/sa ... n-firearms

Vriendelike groete

Fred Camphor

HUB SA JAGTERS


Hierdie e-pos gestuur val onder die kategorie 'Communication - Head Office'. U kan u e-pos voorkeure bestuur by http://secure.sahunters.co.za indien u 'n SA Jagters lid is en nie e-pos wil ontvang wat onder hierdie kategorie val nie.
Gebruik hierdie skakel Unsubscribe om geen verdere e-pos van SA Jagters te ontvang nie (insluitend wagwoord herstel e-posse).

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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by bobby »

carl
the original guys are SAGA
the constitional court case was a flop and as far as i'm concerned gosa stuck thier noses in where it didn't belong.
the other thing with them is that if you got a differant in opionion to one of their members bricks sommer want to get thrown through your shop window, lets just leave it there.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Carl »

bobby wrote:carl
the constitional court case was a flop and as far as i'm concerned gosa stuck thier noses in where it didn't belong.
I beg to differ, the Concourt flop was the SA Hunters case. GOSA case hasn't gone to the Concourt but they did win their case - think it was a High court.

For the rest I cannot comment as there is no public record of any of it.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by EtienneA »

Onthou julle wat gebeur het op 6 Februarie 1838 ?

Dingaan nooi vir Piet Retief en sy metgeselle om te kom kyk na die wedstryd tussen die Bulle en WP. Daar was mos al toe televisie in SA.
Hulle moes hul wapens buite die kraal los. Na ‘n paar dope word Piet-hulle vermoor. Hoekom? Hulle was ontwapen.
Last edited by EtienneA on Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by swc-tr »

As ek so na GOSA en SA Jagters se uitsprake kyk, is dit vir my duidelik on gaan weereens aan die kortste ent trek, ons KAN STEEDS NIE SAAMSTAAN teen 'n gemeenskaplike aanslag op alle vuurwapen eienaars nie.

WANNEER GAAN ONS EENDAG LEER????
Dis 6" agter die kolf wat tel!
"A fool with a tool, is still a fool."
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Harambe »

bobby wrote:carl
the original guys are SAGA
the constitional court case was a flop and as far as i'm concerned gosa stuck thier noses in where it didn't belong.
the other thing with them is that if you got a differant in opionion to one of their members bricks sommer want to get thrown through your shop window, lets just leave it there.
Daar verwoord jy sommer my mening ook. Daai ouens is te blerrie ongeskik. Ek gee maar my geldjies vir SAGA en NHSA en hoop hulle trek almal min of meer in dieselfde rigting. En as Martin Hood die dag begin geld insamel, sal ek vir hom ook ietsie gee.

Daar is in elk geval genoeg mislikke aanhangers wat geldjies gee sodat myne nie juis gemis gaan word nie.
Of so iets
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Eugene »

swc-tr wrote:As ek so na GOSA en SA Jagters se uitsprake kyk, is dit vir my duidelik on gaan weereens aan die kortste ent trek, ons KAN STEEDS NIE SAAMSTAAN teen 'n gemeenskaplike aanslag op alle vuurwapen eienaars nie.

WANNEER GAAN ONS EENDAG LEER????
Schalk, ja, dis ongelukkig my opinie ook en ek sien ons gaan weer harder teen mekaar baklei as teen die res. GOSA het goeie werk gedoen met hulle tussentydse regshulp, maar ek kan nie help om te dink dat hulle uitsprake op hulle facebookblad en die media, hulle al meer soos die EFF laat klink nie.... Baie aggressief en uitlokkend en baklei met alles en almal wat nie 100% met hulle benadering saamstem nie.

Dit is jammer dat 'n organisasie wat eintlik so baie kan bied, so kortsigtig en bombasties kan wees. Ek hoop nie hulle bravade ontplof in hul gesigte nie....

Stephen Palos van CHASA se boodskap maak tans vir my die meeste sin.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by swc-tr »

Ja-nee, as die egos net opsy gesit kan word.....
Dis 6" agter die kolf wat tel!
"A fool with a tool, is still a fool."
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Hein22 »

Eugene wrote:
Stephen Palos van CHASA se boodskap maak tans vir my die meeste sin.
Saam staan bestaan die laaste 30 jaar nie by die blanke bevolking nie. Almal wil die laaste se he. Eugene kan jy dalk sy boodskap vir die van ons wat dit nog nie gesien het nie hier plaas? Ek sien niks op die CHASA website nie.
Geen "OPSIES" op my advertensies nie.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Carl »

Klip in die bos - as die dokument fop nuus is, geen regstatus het ens ens.
Hoekom is dit enigsins opgestel?
Hoekom is art13 uitgehaal???
Hoekom is die aanpassings verwoord so drakonies?

Dalk wil SAPS met die minste na die onderhandlings tafel kom en dan skik in die middel?
Groete,
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Eugene »

Hein22 wrote: Saam staan bestaan die laaste 30 jaar nie by die blanke bevolking nie. Almal wil die laaste se he. Eugene kan jy dalk sy boodskap vir die van ons wat dit nog nie gesien het nie hier plaas? Ek sien niks op die CHASA website nie.
Hier is dit Hein:
CHASA Notice to Members

Draft Version of SAPS Proposed Firearm Act Amendments
Dear Members

The draft document that has been the centre of much media speculation since yesterday morning came to our notice on Tues 16 Oct. I immediately addressed a letter to the Secretary of Police (SoP), Mr Phumu Rapea, copying in the Chairman of the Parliamentary Portfolio Committee for Police (PPCP), Mr Francois Beukman. I specifically called upon the SoP to convene a stakeholder engagement to discuss the matter. I have previously called upon him to start convening stakeholder engagements, as is required of him in the Secretariat of Police Act, to no avail. Both offices have been courteous in acknowledging receipt of my mail, but neither office has as yet addressed a specific response to me. They have however, each released information through their appropriate media.

Yesterday morning I noticed that the draft was widely out in social media with the expected anxiety being expressed by the public. I also noticed later in the morning GOSA calling on people to flood the PPCP Chairman with objection emails. There are a number of reasons why I don’t believe this will be a good tactic, although I must admit it appears to be the reason he made his media release. My prime reasons to not encourage barraging him with emails are that the PPCP is not the originator of draft legislation generally speaking and certainly not in this case. Their oversight and reporting to parliament mandate certainly means they can ask pertinent questions, but I have no reason to suspect they are direct party to driving this particular draft’s content. Another reason it does not help to have a public flooding of the PPCP Chair’s mailbox is that in reality he, and the committee are generally always open to dialogue with all stakeholder representatives, and it stands to reason that if his mailbox is flooded with massive amounts of public emails it could compromise our established communication lines with him and the committee.

But the main entity who does have a functionary role to play, and has certainly not done so, remains the SoP. My letter of Tuesday, just like other previous correspondence, has specifically pointed out the pertinent clauses in the legislation which should compel him to have engaged with us and lead a SAPS/Stakeholder engagement process from way back. He has steadfastly refused or failed in this respect. The draft in question has now been described by the PPCP Chair as “dated internal draft departmental proposals”. The process of creating them must have included interaction with the office of the SoP. We have good reason to believe that Gun-free SA were engaged from time to time, and submitted inputs. This is borne out in much of the shocking content of the draft. It is abhorrent that an entity which still cannot demonstrate any broad-based citizen support and is majority funded by foreign interests is embraced by SAPS and the SoP, while the many local recognised stakeholders with many thousands of proven South African members is totally ostracised from the process that affects us directly.

We remain committed to being a responsible proactive stakeholder/partner with SAPS and the various oversight and legislative authorities towards functional, safe and logical firearm control. But the time has come for these institutions to embrace our long-standing outreach and to enter into credible stakeholder engagement processes. It is not difficult to achieve the common cause, and not just firearm owners, but all South Africans would benefit.

We shall remain vigilant and engage proactively.

Stephen Palos - CEO
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Eugene »

Carl wrote:Klip in die bos - as die dokument fop nuus is, geen regstatus het ens ens.
Hoekom is dit enigsins opgestel?
Hoekom is art13 uitgehaal???
Hoekom is die aanpassings verwoord so drakonies?

Dalk wil SAPS met die minste na die onderhandlings tafel kom en dan skik in die middel?
Carl, die dokument het wel tans geen regstatus nie en kan beskou word as 'n werksdokument of 'n "voorstel" tot wysigings. Dit gee egter 'n baie duidelike indikasie van die rigting wat ingeslaan wil word deur die anti-gun brigade en kan derhalwe nie net afgemaak word as nikseggend nie. Wie dit uitgelek het en wie nie, is nie werklik van waarde nie, maar die feit dat daar so 'n dokument en voorstel is, is wel van waarde. Dit kan baie moontlik wees dat dit doelbewus uitgelek is met die uitsluitlike doel om paniek te saai en die organisasies onder mekaar te laat baklei en as dit die geval is, dan was dit uiters geslaagd.

Siende dat die "voorstel" nou algemene kennis is, gee dit ons as wapeneienaars ten minste die geleentheid om te sien wat moontlik geoog word en kan ons derhalwe ons plan agtermekaar kry om dit teen te staan. AS ons 'n plan kan saamsit waarin elke rolspeler 'n effektiewe rol het...

As voorbeeld, kan ek die volgende gebruik: As 2 of meer partye deur 'n derde party gedagvaar word, dan word daar op 'n stadium 'n vergadering gehou deur die partye wat aangespreek word om taktiek te bespreek oor hoe die aangeleentheid benader gaan word. Dit is om te verseker dat een party nie in sy poging om homself te verontskuldig, die ander party onder die bus gooi nie. Hierdie werk natuurlik net as al die partye "onskuldig" is. Ek het al baie gesien hoe een prokureur/advokaat, wat graag die "show" wil steel en weier om ten minste samesprekings te hou, in die proses, nie net sy eie klient se saak benadeel nie, maar ook die saak se saak aanhelp teen die ander betrokkenes. Dit is my bekommernis hier....
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Carl »

Ek stem saam Steven se verklaring is baie goed en met die nodige gravitas gedoen. Ek stem ook dis verkeerd van GOSA om Francois Beukman se epos so uit te gee - nou kan elk Tom, Dick en Herrie sy menig lig, wat dalk wapen eienaars na anargisitiese fasciste met vêr regse agendas laat lyk.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by 308Win »

Ek wonder of die regering van die dag enigsins omgee oor die ekononie.
Landbou is duidelik nie vir hulle belangrik nie. Plase sonder vergoeding roof. HULLE sal vir die boere wys hoe om te boer.
Buitelandse beleggers is ook nie regtig van belang nie. Hulle geld is welkom, maar hul sal met drakoniese arbeidswetgewing te doen kry. En kraamverlof vir mans.
As buitelandse beleggers grond vir hulle besigheid wil koop, gaan dit gevat word.
Nou vuurwapens. Sonder twyfel sal dit heelwat geweerwinkels en ALMAL wat in hulle werk kelder. So ook wildplase.
So ook die sukkelende Denel.
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by jdpretorius »

van GOSA faceplant site

Australian Gun Law Update.. September 28
Here's a thought to warm some of your hearts....
From: Ed Chenel, A police officer in Australia
Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real
figures from Down Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.
The first year results are now in:
Australia-wide, homicides are up 6.2 percent,
Australia-wide, assaults are up 9.6 percent;
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
In the state of Victoria.....alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent.(Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not and criminals still possess their guns!)
While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady
decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed.There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the elderly, while the resident is at home.
Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in 'successfully ridding Australian society of guns....' You won't see this on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the State Assembly disseminating this information. The Australian experience speaks for itself. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note Americans, before it's too late!

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Groete, Johan
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Meteor
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Meteor »

Gelukkig vir my het ek die sirkus misgekyk. Hoe dit gebeur het weet ek nie want ek is baie op die internet.
Ek sien dit het baie stres gegee so ek is bly ek het dit gemis.

Ek dink die oorsprong van die dokument is minder fantasties as wat mense dink.
Dis 'n eenvoudige saak van 'ons was gevra om te lyk asof ons werk'.
Alles wat die moeite werd is vat tyd en tyd kan nie verdeel word
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Chevvy SS »

Joe13
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Joe13 »

Rigth manne, so wat het met die gebeur?
Johann...

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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Harambe »

Joe13 wrote:Rigth manne, so wat het met die gebeur?
Dit sal seker weer rondom kersfees "bespreek" word. Net mooi die regte tyd vir sommige organisasies om ekstra geldjies te bedel vir kersfees bonusse, ag ek bedoel "legal challenges".
Of so iets
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by Harambe »

308Win wrote:Ek wonder of die regering van die dag enigsins omgee oor die ekononie.
Landbou is duidelik nie vir hulle belangrik nie. Plase sonder vergoeding roof. HULLE sal vir die boere wys hoe om te boer.
Buitelandse beleggers is ook nie regtig van belang nie. Hulle geld is welkom, maar hul sal met drakoniese arbeidswetgewing te doen kry. En kraamverlof vir mans.
As buitelandse beleggers grond vir hulle besigheid wil koop, gaan dit gevat word.
Nou vuurwapens. Sonder twyfel sal dit heelwat geweerwinkels en ALMAL wat in hulle werk kelder. So ook wildplase.
So ook die sukkelende Denel.
Meneer, terwyl hierdie draadjie nou weer aan die gang is, kom ek vertel vir jou my teorie: Hulle is aspris besig om die ekonomie tot niet te maak om van die middelklas ontslae te raak. As jy gaan lees oor die strategie van die kommuniste, dan is een van hul hoofdoele om die middelklas uit te wis, want dis waarvandaan hulle die grootste teenstand sal kry. Die einddoel is om 'n paar ryk kaders en 'n spul arm gepeupel te he, en geen leertjie waarby hulle kan opklim uit die vullis uit nie.

Dis maar net my teorie. Ek skryf sagteware vir 'n lewe, nie politiese ontledings nie.
Of so iets
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Re: Firearm Control Amendment Bill (3) (1)

Post by dennisinpe »

It's not necessary to construct complex conspiracy theories when plain incompetence would do!
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