.38 S&W herlaai inligting

[hendrikm]

Hi.

Ek het gekyk in die somchem boekie en daar was toe niks inligting vir die kaliber nie, so toe praat ek met Manie Johannes daar by Rheimetall en hy het toe die volgende vir my gestuur:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since Somchem do not test this caliber, I can suggest loads based on calculated data

or on information based on powders which is similar to those of Somchem.

(see notes below especially point 3)

Caliber: 38 S&W

Powder: MP200

Bullet weight: 120-125 gr

Start load: 2.3 grains (estimated 550-650Ft/p/sec)

Maximum load: 3.2 grains (estimated 700-800Ft/p/sec)

Bullet weight: 158gr

Start load: 2.0 grains (estimated 500-600Ft/p/sec)

Maximum load: 2.9 grains (estimated 600-700 Ft/p/sec)



IMPORTANT NOTICES:

1. NB!! Always start loading at the recommended minimum (start) charge/load, work up gradually in increments of 1.5 to 2% of the nominal charge, closely observing for pressure signs.

2. No liability is accepted, either expressed or implied, for damage or injury, arising from, or alleged to have risen from the use of the above information.

3. When a particular caliber is not tested by Somchem, it will be indicated as such. If and when information is provided, it will be based on overseas data with propellants which is similar (never equivalent!) to the Somchem products. This information must serve as a guideline only, and must be treated as such. NB! It is very important that velocity is measured with the suggested start load, and compared with the estimated velocity.

4. Maximum limits:

4.1. If velocity can be measured, do not exceed the maximum published velocity value

4.2. If velocity cannot be measured, do not exceed the maximum charge.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ek het toe gewonder of ek kan kyk na iets soos S121, ek sien heelwat mense het al die vergelyking gemaak het tussen Somchem en die oorsese kruite en volgens daai tabelle sal dit moontlik wees? Is dit iets wat julle sal aanraai om te kyk na S121 of moet ek maar eerder bly by MP200? Manie het my aangeraai om maar te bly by MP200.

Watter een sal ook beter werk in die dispenser?

[vriell]

Wat is jou loop lengte ?

[Pvdw]

Ek het 2.1gr S121 gelaai op 143gr lood koeël vir my vrou se revolver. Spoed was tussen 580 en 600ft/s

[vriell]

Gegewe dis 'n 4" loop doen MS200 beter in QL simulasie
Pvdw,Het jy dalk die QL S121 "powder file" ? Ek begin ook een of ander tyd die kaliber te laai...Pa se Polisie rewolwer en moet nog aansoek doen vir lisensie een of ander tyd.

[hendrikm]

Dis n 4".

[vriell]

Dis n 4".

Dankie Hendrik.Het nounet gesimuleer met Norma R1 kruit wat volgens die BRF tabel gelykstaande is aan S121 van Somchem en is beslis die beter keuse wat vulling en verbranding % en ontbranding betref en stem omtrent ooreen met PvdW se info....

[hendrikm]

Baie dankie, kan ek dan n groot guns vra asb?

Ek sien die meeste fabrikaat punte wat ek kan kry is in 125gr, 148gr, en 158gr. Kan ek dalk vra vir n veilige lading vir daai 3 punte asb, hulle prys is basies almal dieselfde so ek het nog nie besluit wat ek sal gebruik nie, ek het maar gedink om 158gr te gebruik, lyk my die meeste van die rollies hou maar van hulle in hierdie kaliber.

[vriell]

Baie dankie, kan ek dan n groot guns vra asb?

Ek sien die meeste fabrikaat punte wat ek kan kry is in 125gr, 148gr, en 158gr. Kan ek dalk vra vir n veilige lading vir daai 3 punte asb, hulle prys is basies almal dieselfde so ek het nog nie besluit wat ek sal gebruik nie, ek het maar gedink om 158gr te gebruik, lyk my die meeste van die rollies hou maar van hulle in hierdie kaliber.

Sal kyk en laat weet....maar watse kruit gaan jy hiervoor gebruik ?

[hendrikm]

Ek sal dan gaan vir S121.

[vriell]

Ek sal dan gaan vir S121.

OK sal laat weet..

[hendrikm]

Baie dankie!

[vriell]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
WARNING: Table produced by not verified Ballistics Calculations! Check results
always against loading data of current reloading manuals! Input data and results
may be invalid or wrong! The use of this data for loading ammunition can cause,
directly or indirectly, serious injury to personnel and material. No responsibi-
lity is implied and THE USER MUST ASSUME THE ENTIRE RISK OF USING THE DATA.
QuickLOAD© V.3.2 Interior Ballistics V.3.2 #230031
© Copyright 1987-2006 - H.Broemel, Babenhausen, Germany
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Case capacity and propellant properties may vary considerably from lot to lot!

**** Input data: Date: 4-Jun-2014 Time: 09:18:16
Cartridge................. = .38 S&W (Colt N.P.) (SAAMI)
Projectile type........... = .358, 158, Hornady LRN 10508 with flatbase

Max.avg.pressure(Piezo SAA)= 1000 bar Shot start / init pressure = 80 bar
Projectile weight (g)= 10.24 Groove caliber (mm)= 9.13
Length of cartridge (mm)= 31.5 Length of case (mm)= 19.68
Case capacity (cu.cm)= 0.78 Length of projectile (mm)= 17.78
Length of barrel (mm)= 101.6
**** Values calculated:
Seating depth (mm)= 5.97 Volume displaced (cu.cm)= 0.39
Comb.chamber volume (cu.cm)= 0.39 Projectile travel (cm)= 8.79
**** Input data:
Propellant type........... = Somchem s121 (R1 Norma )
Charge weight...........(g)= 0.117 (1.8 gr) Load density......(g/cu.cm)= 0.302
Heat of Explosion (kJ/kg)= 4030 Ratio of spec. heats cp/cv = 1.222
Solid density (g/cu.cm)= 1.61 Weighting factor...........= 0.50
Burning rate factor Ba(1/s)= 3.20 Pro-/degressivity factor a = 9
Burning limit ......... z1 = 0.3 Combust.Chamber Vb(m³)= 3.873903E-7
Factor.................. b = 2.4 X-S.Area of Bore A(m²)= 6.384E-5
Bulk density (g/cu.cm)= 0.465 Projectile mass mp(kg)= 1.0238E-2
Loading ratio (%)= 65.0 Projectile travel x(m)= 8.7885E-2

**** Results calculated:
Maximum pressure ........ = 823 bar Way of projectile at Pmax = 5.6 mm
Muzzle velocity ......Ve = 185 m/s(608fps) Muzzle pressure .......Pe = 109 bar
Project. energy at muzzle = 176 J Fraction of powder burnt = 100 %
Projectile travel time from 10% Pmax to muzzle = 0.82 ms

Real maximum of pressure inside barrel.
End of combustion before the projectile passes muzzle.


Goeie "veilige" begin lading vir Hornady 158gr koeels is so 1.5 gr s121 volgens QL ( ongeveer 500fps)as ek die spoed gebruik wat deur Somchem voorgestel word tot so ongeveer 1.8 weereens volgens Somchem se spoed gegewens vir spoed ongeveer 608fps en dalk hoër na 700fps maksimum maar sal versigtig moet aanpas en op werk na die spoed in klein inkremente ( .1) om veilig te speel.

Ligter koeels simulasie volg...

[vriell]

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
WARNING: Table produced by not verified Ballistics Calculations! Check results
always against loading data of current reloading manuals! Input data and results
may be invalid or wrong! The use of this data for loading ammunition can cause,
directly or indirectly, serious injury to personnel and material. No responsibi-
lity is implied and THE USER MUST ASSUME THE ENTIRE RISK OF USING THE DATA.
QuickLOAD© V.3.2 Interior Ballistics V.3.2 #230031
© Copyright 1987-2006 - H.Broemel, Babenhausen, Germany
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Case capacity and propellant properties may vary considerably from lot to lot!

**** Input data: Date: 4-Jun-2014 Time: 09:53:46
Cartridge................. = .38 S&W (Colt N.P.) (SAAMI)
Projectile type........... = .358, 140, LEE 358-140_SWC with flatbase

Max.avg.pressure(Piezo SAA)= 14500 psi Shot start / init pressure = 1160 psi
Projectile weight (gr)= 140 Groove caliber (in)= 0.360
Length of cartridge (in)= 1.240 Length of case (in)= 0.775
Case capacity(Grains Water)= 12.00 Length of projectile (in)= 0.634
Length of barrel (in)= 4.000
**** Values calculated:
Seating depth (in)= 0.169 Volume displaced (gn H2O)= 4.33
Comb.chamber volume(gn H2O)= 7.67 Projectile travel (in)= 3.394
**** Input data:
Propellant type........... = Somchem s121 (R1 Norma )
Charge weight..........(gr)= 1.8 Load density......(g/cu.cm)= 0.235
Heat of Explosion (cal/lb)= 436612 Ratio of spec. heats cp/cv = 1.222
Solid density (gr/cu.in)= 407.2 Weighting factor...........= 0.5
Burning rate factor Ba(1/s)= 3.20 Pro-/degressivity factor a = 9.000
Burning limit ......... z1 = 0.3 Combust.Chamber Vb(ft³)= 1.758337E-5
Factor.................. b = 2.389 X-S.Area of Bore A(ft²)= 6.871905E-4
Bulk density (gr/cu.in)= 117.6 Projectile mass mp (lb)= 2.0E-2
Loading ratio (%)= 50.5 Projectile travel x(ft)= 2.828084E-1

**** Results calculated:
Maximum pressure ........ = 8409 psi Way of projectile at Pmax = 0.28 in
Muzzle velocity ......Ve = 595 fps Muzzle pressure .......Pe = 1722 psi
Project. energy at muzzle = 110 ft.lbs Fraction of powder burnt = 99.8 %
Projectile travel time from 10% Pmax to muzzle = 0.89 ms

Real maximum of pressure inside barrel.

"Veilige" begin lading volgens QL weereens gebaseer op Somchem se minimum en Maksimum spoed gegewens is 1.8ge s121 tot maksimum van 2.1gr s121 maar moet weereens opwerk na hierdie lading in klein inkremente van .1gr.
Net soos by gewere verskil handwapens se specs ook so om die ladings aan te pas sonder om Chrony lesings te neem IN ALLE gevalle kan onverantwoordelik wees waar mens met die "onbekende" te doen het.
Hoop dit help...
LET OP DAT HIERDIE ALLE BOGENOEMDE GEGEWENS IS MET LOODKOEELS EN NIE JACKETED GEDOEN NIE.lAAT WEET WATTER KOEELS JY KAN KRY (BV HORNADY ENS) SODAT DAAR WEER GESIMULEER KAN WORD MET MEER KORREKTE INLIGTING BV OOK DOP KAPASITEIT...

[hendrikm]

Baie dankie vir die hulp. Ek sal weer terugkom sodra ek meer inligting het, maar sover lyk dit of dit lood koeels sal wees (Nobletech) , ek sal ook bietjie die dop kapasiteit gaan meet, en dan sal ek probeer so paar lesings deur n chrony kry.

Weereens baie dankie vir al die hulp.

[vriell]

Reg so Hendrik as jy ook die koeels gekoop het ook net die lengte en weereens die gewig van die koeels deurgee asb.dan kan mens net weer simuleer.Die lading en volume asook die spoed verander nogal vinnig soos gegewens aangepas word so dit sal beter wees om so akkuraat as moontlik inligting in QL te sit vir simulasie alvorens jy gaan laai net om weer dubbeld seker te maak..